Wednesday, June 14, 2006

Why Muslims want to kill us

Gordon Nickel, who teaches at a Christian university in Canada, discusses--verse by verse--all those Koranic commands about killing "unbelievers," "idolators," and "polytheists".

At face value, therefore, polytheists appear to be at greater risk than Jews or Christians.

Yes, that would be us Pagans today, I think, not just someone in the Middle East centuries ago. You think differently?

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Blogger Hecate said...

Well, it's the xians who've actually made a habit of burning witches, but I have little doubt that I'd survive long in a radical Islamic nation. I'm more concerned about the fact that I'm now living in a radical xian nation.

11:45 AM  
Blogger Chas S. Clifton said...

You might consider that all monotheisms are inherently dangerous, when combined with political power, by their very nature.

1:21 PM  
Blogger Hecate said...

all monotheisms are inherently dangerous,


2:35 PM  
Anonymous tarma said...

i'm not sure i trust the opinion on islam (academic or not) of someone who has spent the past 15 years as a Christian missionary among Muslims.

5:34 PM  
Blogger Chas S. Clifton said...

The verses still say what they say, and fundamentalists of any sort tend to read their scriptures literally.

6:11 PM  
Blogger Hecate said...


Are you really that scared of the big, bad Muslims?

Last I checked, xian fundamentalists in the U.S. eat shellfish, even though their book says they shouldn't.

6:20 PM  
Anonymous Kate in Canada said...

Because of the specific danger from Muslims to Pagans, a friend serving in the Canadian forces lists a childhood religion on dogtags, although Wiccan is accepted.

7:06 PM  
Blogger Chas S. Clifton said...


Look at it this way: Xian fundamentalists can be a pain, but when was the last time a group of young men from, say, the Church of the Nazarene flew an airplane into a building, blew up a train or subway, or planned to behead the prime minister of Canada?

Kate, I hope that Canada wakes up from its dream of multicultural harmony.

8:13 AM  
Blogger branruadh said...

Monotheism is bad when mixed with political power? I trust you don't mean to imply polytheism is inherently more giving and peaceful. I remind you of three words uttered by many a polytheist in their day: Carthago delenda est.

I will say that yes, we as pagans should not be so quick to think the radical Muslims our brothers in oppression or believe peaceful means are the only way with such people. Al Qaeda would wipe me out as fast as they would anyone else for what I believe. I have a friend who's a Zoroastrian from Kurdistan who could go on for hours about what Islam tried to do to his ancestors over their faith and how glad he is that the US invaded Iraq, as Saddam's campaign against them was finally stopped by our doing so. But we're not immune to fanaticism and fundamentalism. We're just not in as high a place as some, so we turn on each other over petty theological points and make rude comments about Christians.

12:04 AM  
Blogger Chas S. Clifton said...

No, of course I do not imply that polytheists are inherently peaceful. Nor do I subscribe to the myth of the "peaceful ancient matriarchy."

At most, one might say that polytheistic cultures were less likely to cloak their aggressions in theological disguises. They warred over natural resources or because this king felt that that king had insulted him, just as humans always have.

8:11 AM  
Blogger Frostbeard said...

The reason that monotheists are particularily bad when given political power is that they believe, by definition, that their way is the ONLY way. If you believe in multiple gods, you're automaticly "wrong", and with the political power comes the will and the way to "correct" you.

8:31 AM  
Blogger branruadh said...

Frostbeard, Hinduism has been just as vile and oppressive in its history as Christianity. Ask any Buddhist. Or lower-caste citizen of India. And the polytheistic Romans were pretty lousy toward religions that wouldn't bow to their ways, too. They didn't learn to be empire-building massacre artists from Jesus. They did just fine as polytheists against the druids. Monotheism is not the only way to one-true-wayism. It's just the most visible modern example.

10:27 PM  
Anonymous not an american said...

I do not know about Islam, but I do know that the newspaper you have quoted is the most right wing rag in Canada. I also would never trust a Christian to tell me what another religion is about. As if Christianity has ever been a religion of peace despite what their main man preached. That newspaper has been trying to get people all worked up over these imcompetent terrorists from day 1. As for the beheading of Harper, apparently they gave that up because they did not know their way around Ottawa. I suppose they could have asked politely. Except for the right wing wankers, most people here realize that it was mostly a PR thing by the government and police. The last time we had this, quietly and quickly the so-called terrorists were released when the evidence was non-existent.Yes it is spooky. I am really disappointed and I guess with all the other blogs out there, I do not need to come back here again. Live and learn and here I thought that an academic would knew better.

9:31 PM  
Blogger Chas S. Clifton said...

"Not an American" does not want to believe anything from the National Post, which is a conservative paper, but s/he might remember that even a stopped clock tells the correct time twice a day.

But his/her logic is wondrous: the monotheistic jihadi terrorists were caught. Therefore they are "incompetent."

After they succeed in setting off a bomb on the Toronto subway or something like that, then we can take them seriously.

And it's all Prime Minister Harper's sinister plot anyway.

Now you can see why Canada is an even softer target for terrorism than is the US.

11:01 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yes, it's true. Islam is about the whole sale extermination of all non-believers. Being a Christian, a retired US Army guy, and a guy who listens and then reads a bit, it is true that the enemy of all relegions regardless of origin is Islam. A Jew will laugh at you, a Christian will talk to you, a Budhist will smile at you, and a Muslim must Kill everyone else before the Jews and Christians. Any Muslim that does not take the verses of the Koran at face value, regardless of sanity, is a heratic and worthy of death from a fellow Muslim, i.e. the Afghan who went to Italy, returned and was to be executed for being a convert remember? Wake up and realize who the enemy is to us all, its not the Chrisitan right as some call it, but the Liberals who think that no harm lurks behind the Mosque walls.

2:50 PM  

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